U/R Thieves Deck 1.5

Beyond Dominia: The Type 1.5/1.X Magic Mill: U/R Thieves Deck 1.5

By Pernicious Dude (Pern) on Sunday, December 30, 2001 - 09:03 pm:

Type 1.5 counterburn deck with some odd choices

Simple concept.
Burn or tim the blockers and attack.
Remove threats with Thief, draw with Ophidian

Needs some bounce or something to remove permanents, not sure how to fit it.


10 Island
10 Mountain
4 Volcanic Island
3 Reef Shaman (U 1-drop, mana smoothing, mini port, weenie blocker)
4 Razorfin Hunter (a tim for 2? nasty)
4 Rootwater Thief
2 Ophidian
4 Impulse
4 Seal of Fire (R 1-drop)
4 Incinerate (over bolt for the anti-regen)
4 Fire/Ice
4 Counterspell
3 Mana Leak

4 Hydroblast
4 Pyroblast
4 Dodecapod
3 Anarchy


By Tuna! on Monday, December 31, 2001 - 12:05 am:

force of will would be good

By don on Tuesday, January 01, 2002 - 06:42 am:

Hi pernicious dude

Though it may seem a bit strange, I would consider dropping most of the creatures. Yes, they're good, but they're not good enough in a Counter-Burn strategy, where you want to cast your spells in your opponents turn. This gives you the amazing flexibility that makes CounterBurn so lethal. Casting things in your turn is generally bad, so I would make the following changes:

-3 Reef Shaman
-4 Razorfin Hunter
-4 Rootwater Thief

and I would add:

+4 Force of Will
+2 Ophidian (they're very good, and your opponent can't sideboard out all his anti-creature stuff and bring in all his hate)
+1 Mana Leak
+3 Pyroclasm (wipes out weenie hordes)
+1 Hammer of Bogardan/Shard Phoenix (amazing classics)

Dropping the Seal of Fire and adding Firebolt gives you more firepower in the long game (which is the game you want to play), so I would consider that option. If you have some space left in your deck, try to fit in a couple of Fact or Fiction or Morphling.


By Pernicious Dude (Pern) on Tuesday, January 01, 2002 - 01:30 pm:

Yah, you're probably right, that would make it a better deck.
I still want to make it work, though.
The Hunters and Thieves are creatures I particularly hate to see when they're on the other side of the table.
I think I'll drop the 3 Reef Shaman for the other 2 Phids and the 4th Leak.

Fact or Fiction is officially out of 1.5 as of today, or they'd be in over the Phids.

By Brian Epstein (Briane) on Wednesday, January 02, 2002 - 10:10 pm:

Pyro/Hydroblasts should become Red/Blue Elemental Blasts.

Hunters are bad. Again, maybe it's my warped metagame speaking, but there is a *LOT* of weenie hate (most notably, Fire/Ice). I would argue that Mogg Fanatics are better.

Lose the Impulses and run Brainstorm instead; if you don't establish control early, you'll lose. In order to establish such control, you want the cheaper spell and the one that'll reward your consistency.

I would lose the Thiefs, since Don is absolutely right about Pyroclasm being necessary to control weenie hoards; there's no need for an "okay" card to be left in when it has negative synergy with a great card.

I would also lose 4 lands, probably 4 Mountains (but I'd have to give it a better look to make sure your ratios are right).

The Dodecapods in the SB are a little random. If you're worried aboust discard, these should probably be something like Divert (Funeral Charm and Hymn, but not Duress).

By Pernicious Dude (Pern) on Thursday, January 03, 2002 - 11:26 am:

Why Red/Blue over Pyro/Hydro?

The main reason I like the Hunters is because they _are_ weenie hate, and they're reusable.
Once one hits the table they have to kill it or not bother playing weenies of their own.
If they're killing it, they're not chasing my Thief and my Phid.

I don't generally like Brainstorm with no shuffling effects in the deck, and Impulse digs deeper.
I think you're right, though, especially after I pull the Reef Shamans.
Brainstorm's a good first turn play, and it's useful for hiding something critical from discard.

The black players in my area are good enough not to play Hymn before Duress, and they don't run Funeral Charm.
Divert won't do a thing about a Hyppie.
I even have 4 Divert, and I've been disappointed nearly every time I've drawn one.
The Pods are decent critters in their own right,
and I'm trying to keep the deck on the aggro/active side, not reactive.

I'd love to lose a couple of lands.
Mr. Long wants his activation mana, though.
I know, I know, lose the Thieves.

I really would like a little bounce in there somewhere.
A couple Capsize, or maybe Washout and/or Hibernation in the side?

By Pernicious Dude (Pern) on Wednesday, January 09, 2002 - 09:32 pm:

Brainstorm over Impulse is definitely working.
3 Masticore over 1 Thief, 1 Hunter and 1 Mountain is also working pretty well.
I'd like more card drawing, but I think I haven't been using the Ice side to my advantage.

You were right about another thing, too.
Pyroclasm is good, and the Dodecapods are gone.
Kill the Hyppy and he won't make me discard.
As a side benefit, Negator takes 2.

I still like the Hunters a lot.
Reusable damage is good, and they're disposably cheap.
The Thieves are on the side, to find the Donate and whatever sideboard hate they brought in.

OK, so here's where we're at.


mana 23
11 Island, 11 Mountain, 1 Shivan Reef (the Volcanics were wishful thinking)

critters 10
3 Razorfin Hunter
4 Ophidian
3 Masticore

utility 27
4 Counterspell
4 Mana Leak
4 Brainstorm
1 Standstill (random, should probably be Pyroclasm)
4 Fire/Ice
4 Seal of Fire
4 Incinerate
2 Pyroclasm (all I own)

4 Hydroblast
4 Pyroblast
3 Anarchy
3 Rootwater Thieves
1 Back To Basics (all I own)

Considering dropping my beloved Thieves to Hibernation.
We'll see after I find someone here to playtest RandomElf.dec and Stompy.

By Pernicious Dude (Pern) on Sunday, January 13, 2002 - 10:54 am:

That was big fun.
I found a third Pyroclasm for the Standstill,
dropped the Hunters for 2 Scrying Glass and 1 maindeck Back To Basics.
4 Thieves to the side.

1st round I ran right over the counter/sliver that took first last week.
Lost an elimination match to a boneheaded play,
countered something I should have let through with my one card in hand, Masticore on the table.

The deck rocks. Answers on demand.
Scrying Glass was fabulous.
Side it and the Glaciers out for more counters against hyperspeed decks.
In the long game it gives me info and cards, and that's a Good Thing.

I never sided in the Thieves, so they're gone.
Sideboard is now
4 Hydroblast
4 Pyroblast
4 Anarchy
2 Price Of Progress
1 Back To Basics

Red and Blue have so many amazing sideboard choices, though.
Hibernation, Washout, Red and Blue Blasts, Rushing River, Extract, Misdirection, Earthquake, Nevy's, Powder Keg...

The current metagame problem is Stasis/Kismet.
I didn't get to play against it, so I don't know how I'll do.
Any tips?

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